In this powerful first installment of a two-part conversation, former Navy SEAL commander and performance expert Rich Diviney returns to The Dwayne Kerrigan Podcast to discuss his groundbreaking new book, The Masters of Uncertainty.
With decades of leadership inside one of the world’s most elite military units, Rich unpacks how we can all perform better under pressure, lead with clarity in chaos, and transform anxiety into purposeful action.
Dwayne and Rich dive into the neuroscience behind fear, the underestimated power of identity, and the simple yet potent tools you can use to build teams that scale with integrity. Whether you're a business owner, leader, or high performer—this episode is a masterclass in navigating the unknown with confidence and precision.
Timestamps:
00:00 - Introduction
02:10 - Masters of Chaos Insights
05:51 - Rich's Background and Expertise
07:31 - Catching Up with Rich
10:24 - The Goodness of People
14:55 - Business Progress Update
18:42 - Scaling Leadership Effectively
23:44 - The 41 Leadership Attributes
26:34 - Overcoming Current Struggles
29:24 - Navigating Patience Challenges
34:53 - Identity During Transitions
42:46 - Mastering Uncertainty Techniques
49:20 - Neuroscience of Panic and Procrastination
55:00 - Managing Anxiety Strategies
59:27 - Benefits of Breath Work
01:03:05 - Breath-Holding Warning
01:05:33 - Expanding Horizons
01:06:05 - Outro
Notable Quotes:
“Leadership is about creating the environment where your team can outrun you.” – Rich Diviney
“When the shit hits the fan, personality goes out the window. That’s when attributes take over.” – Rich Diviney
“True confidence is knowing that when uncertainty hits, I’ll figure it out—and I’m okay.” – Rich Diviney
“Most people are not aware of how driven they are by the need for certainty. That’s what holds them back.” – Dwayne Kerrigan
Resources & Tools Mentioned:
• Rich Diviney’s assessment & attributes work: www.theattributes.com
• Assessment tool use promo code KERRIGAN15: https://hub.theattributes.com/
• The Masters of Uncertainty – https://learn.theattributes.com/mastering-uncertainty
• The Attributes Book (2021) – foundational read on human performance
• Physiological Sigh (breathwork tool) – Explained in Andrew Huberman’s work
• Open-gaze technique – A tool for reducing autonomic arousal instantly
Top Takeaways for Business Leaders:
1. Uncertainty + Anxiety = Fear - Break the cycle by managing one or both.
2. The Identity Shift Matter - Retire old “I AM” statements that no longer serve you. Choose new ones consciously.
3. Breath and Vision Are Performance Tools - Use the “physiological sigh” and panoramic vision to reset your nervous system.
4. Attributes Greater than Personality in Stress - Know how your team shows up under pressure, not just how they act when it’s easy.
5. Great Leadership is Scalable - Teach a language of performance so others can lead with the same clarity and impact.
Connect with Dwayne Kerrigan
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Website: http://www.dwaynekerrigan.com
Disclaimer The views, information, or opinions expressed by guests during The Dwayne Kerrigan Podcast are solely those of the individuals involved and do not necessarily represent those of Dwayne Kerrigan and his affiliates. Dwayne Kerrigan or The Dwayne Kerrigan Podcast is not responsible for and does not verify the accuracy of any of the information contained in the podcast series. The primary purpose of this podcast is to educate and inform. Listeners are advised to consult with a qualified professional or specialist before making any decisions based on the content of this podcast.
